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so, you've been around since 07 and swapped a trans in your GTE car without researching the limits of your AR5 trans? bold move.

the listed 'limit' on wikipedia is 260 ft/lbs although i have been told this is a useless number put out by MFGs. FWIW, i just read the r154 is only rated for 254 ft lbs (according to this thread AR5 Trans Take Two: The Solstice Solution | Supramania), but we all know it can take more than that.

applying the same logic to the AR5, id say its in the neighborhood of a R154.
 

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450 WHP? What was the history of the trans? Original? I’m curious because I planned on using a w58 500whp planned build, maybe I will reconsider.
Don't know the history on the broken W58, but when it went in it shifted smoothly and it ran quietly. It broke 3rd gear in the middle of a pull, not immediately after shifting. I think the gear teeth were simply not able to carry the load.

To anybody interested, I'm upgrading to a T56, so my complete R154 arrangement will be for sale in the coming weeks.
 

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so, you've been around since 07 and swapped a trans in your GTE car without researching the limits of your AR5 trans? bold move.

the listed 'limit' on wikipedia is 260 ft/lbs although i have been told this is a useless number put out by MFGs. FWIW, i just read the r154 is only rated for 254 ft lbs (according to this thread AR5 Trans Take Two: The Solstice Solution | Supramania), but we all know it can take more than that.

applying the same logic to the AR5, id say its in the neighborhood of a R154.

Again, I knew it was the succesor to the R154 clunker I ripped out of there so it was at least stronger than a W series :puhlease:. I do not need anything more than that. W55's I've seen hold up but I've also seen brake under stock power so that's that.

And yes, in my first post I say that most of the "it should hold this or that" is based on the fact that it is derived from the R154. I just haven't seen many "Blew my AR5 at XXX tq" threads anywhere other than that solstice dude pushing 700.

I wish I could say I was as bold as you suggest :D but I'm not.
 

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im not sure if your being sarcastic or not, as it sounds like youve already installed an AR5 trans?

with that being said, i believe zilvia has a pretty comprehensive thread. lots of the S chassis guys are starting to realize the superiority of the JZ over the RB series engines (fight me if you disagree); although most seem to be unhappy with the R154. most swap to an AR5 or CD009.

hell, theres even a SR guy swapping a BMW trans into his S chassis.
I'm not. I have an AR5 because it fit my needs of stock gte daily driving and not made out of glass. But as far as how much they hold or at what torque they start breaking I have no clue....and would be an interesting read.
Never had mine on a dyno, but I’m running a s362sxe @ 15psi. The AR5 has no problems so far, could prolly turn the boost up a bit more. I boost every single time I drive it, too.
 

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it is surprising that there isnt more info out there regarding the AR transmissions. with how popular they are you think there would be more info. i anticipate as more start to make the switch info will become more available. with the CD009 being so popular, i feel like that trans gets far more attention than the AR 5.

its such a shame we get all of these great power plant options, yet every trans option we have available to us has some sort of major drawback, or requires more money in swap parts than the trans itself.

i did come across a solstice thread earlier i chose not to share because some were claiming the trans would go (along with the rest of the drive line) at 400 whp. there was no definitive proof, so it seemed as if it was all speculation.
 

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it is surprising that there isnt more info out there regarding the AR transmissions. with how popular they are you think there would be more info. i anticipate as more start to make the switch info will become more available. with the CD009 being so popular, i feel like that trans gets far more attention than the AR 5.

its such a shame we get all of these great power plant options, yet every trans option we have available to us has some sort of major drawback, or requires more money in swap parts than the trans itself.

i did come across a solstice thread earlier i chose not to share because some were claiming the trans would go (along with the rest of the drive line) at 400 whp. there was no definitive proof, so it seemed as if it was all speculation.
I’d say that’s speculation. Jeez I hope I’m at least 400whp lol.
 

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Everything is speculation. Those who see the glass half full say 700 those who see it half empty say 400. The transmission feels solid and it's been working great for close to a year now but the R154, when sitting next to it, seemed a bit beefier. Then again, it shifted like shit and probably needed a rebuild or something. I do not miss it.
 

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450 WHP? What was the history of the trans? Original? I’m curious because I planned on using a w58 500whp planned build, maybe I will reconsider. I’m new here and I’m trying to read and research before posting too many questions. I’m starting to collect parts now, IS300 wagon manual swap if anyone can direct me to any existing posts? Good to be here, great info thanks all!
That'll go a long ways for you.

Here's something to start with https://www.my.is/forums/f114/r154-ultimate-auto-manual-swap-info-thread-379074/

Edit: Agreed with the post above. I wouldn't do any W series transmission for a high-er power build. Even an AR5 I would think about. It is what I have right now but I just run a stock gte and won't increase power too much. From reading around it doesn't seem it's been tested all that much (except for that ONE guy with a 2jz solstice). Most of the lore behind it stems from it being the "successor" to the R154.

If anyone knows about posts and stuff on AR5 limits please point me in their direction. Would love to know exactly what I swapped in.
450 WHP? What was the history of the trans? Original? I’m curious because I planned on using a w58 500whp planned build, maybe I will reconsider.
Don't know the history on the broken W58, but when it went in it shifted smoothly and it ran quietly. It broke 3rd gear in the middle of a pull, not immediately after shifting. I think the gear teeth were simply not able to carry the load.

To anybody interested, I'm upgrading to a T56, so my complete R154 arrangement will be for sale in the coming weeks.
Thanks for the info guys! I’m still in early stages of planning, but I’m daily driving my platform now and finishing my shop within the next few weeks if weather permits. When it’s done I’ll start collecting parts. I’ve got LOTS of reading to do in the meantime. How much for the R154 setup, what state are you in?
 

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Hell ya, me too, seems like the best choice on the market right now
Yes, I think it is clearly the best overall option at this point. It's a known-good trans, with suitable gearing, with lots of confidence of future support.

The R154, while functional, is old, clunky and obsolete...with limited support.

The V160 is not only ridiculously priced, but if you have any problem with it, you're screwed. Plus, our 3.7x or 3.9x rear gear is a terrible match to it. Getting a 3.1x rear gear will cost thousands more.

The CD009 saves ~1500 over the T56, which isn't insignificant, but its gearing is also a lousy match, and the whole "cut off the bellhousing" and use an adaptor concept is kinda cheesy. Considering to do the job right, (with good clutch, hydraulics, aluminum driveshaft, etc) the CD009 will still set you back $6k, it seems like at that point you might as well spend the extra $1500 to do the T56.

I had to think long and hard before spending $7500 on this T56 arrangement. Our cars are not desireable to people with money. Sure, there are a lot of 20 year olds that drool over a well-done turbo IS300, but nobody with $30k to spend wants one. So any money spent on these cars is money that'll never come back from resale.
 

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As for the money invested on the T56, depending on what gear set you choose, you can get better gas mileage with the suuuuper long overdrive gears, which lets you get your money back. I did some rough math and the average driver would be able to save the cost of the trans ($3200) over about 7 years. Which is pretty good if you drive accordingly.


I had to think long and hard before spending $7500 on this T56 arrangement.
Where are you getting the $7500 figure from? When I priced out mine it comes to just over $5400 with all the required bits, pieces, and fluids shipped, sans a new clutch. Granted there is no labor costs since I'm doing the install, maybe that's where the difference comes in, even still $2100 in labor is pretty excessive for a trans swap.


So any money spent on these cars is money that'll never come back from resale.
I would like to believe that if you're putting in an upgraded transmission you're increasing resale slightly, probably able to get back 60% of the trans.
 

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In round numbers:

Trans - 3200
bellhousing - 700
Driveshaft - 700
Hydraulics - 750 (tilton slave and tilton 3/4" master and stainless lines/fittings)
crossmember & mount - 300
Clutch - 1700 (at a minimum)

https://www.grannasracing.com/products/group-buy-deposit


Theres some other incidentals also, but it basically works out to $7500ish. The cost of a good clutch is not an incidental, it makes up a big part of the cost. I already have a "stage 3" ceramic puck single plate clutch, and I hate it. It's noisy, and its engagement characteristics suck. A clutch that drives nice and handles a bunch of torque (a multiplate) is expensive, no way around it.

As I mentioned, I spent a lot of time considering how best to skin this cat, to include piecing something together instead of buying a complete kit. I found old non-magnum LT1 and LS1 T56s for $1500ish, and TR6060's from LS2s and LS3s seem to fetch between $2k and $2.5k. Then you need a $350 midplate for the bellhousing to work, plus the gear ratios are unideal. It just doesn't seem worth getting a used/unknown trans and having to buy parts to get it all to work, when you can buy a NIB T56 magnum with the right gearing for $3200.

You could shave a couple hundred off by fabricating the crossmember yourself, and also by using lower quality hydraulic parts. The Tilton 6000 is $400 and requires a 3/4" master, which is $350 more. The OEM GM slave cylinder/release bearing is a known weak point, so that isn't (much) of an option. In fairness though, you can save a handful of dollars buying a cheaper master and slave.

Anyway, cutting every possible corner I could, I figured this setup was gonna cost me $6k minimum. A lot to spend on an old Toyota hardly anybody cares about - but I have a hard on for these cars; so I'm not gonna spend $6k on a "decently done" job when I can spend $7500 on an "awesomely done" job.

Wasn't sure if you're joking about recouping the trans swap cost via increased fuel economy? Are we both talking about high power 2J cars???
 

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In round numbers:

Clutch - 1700 (at a minimum)

https://www.grannasracing.com/products/group-buy-deposit
Ah, there it is, that's what I was thinking next, you got the nice clutch, but you're saving a little with the group buy. I decided not to do the group buy since I wasn't going for the clutch upgrade.


You could shave a couple hundred off by fabricating the cross member yourself, and also by using lower quality hydraulic parts.
If you've seen Joel's video on the cross member, he seems to do a really nice job for as much as he is charging, so I saw it as a worthwhile investment. I personally love Rude Boy performance's billet aluminum cross member, although Joel doesn't include it in his kit.

Wasn't sure if you're joking about recouping the trans swap cost via increased fuel economy? Are we both talking about high power 2J cars???
Haha, unfortunately we are not on the same level. I'm still N/A, so I can't get on it the same way as some of you guys. Hence why I was sticking with the stock clutch.


On another note, are you sticking with the stock dual mass flywheel, or does the clutch come with the flywheel all nicely balanced with each other?
 

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On another note, are you sticking with the stock dual mass flywheel, or does the clutch come with the flywheel all nicely balanced with each other?
.

For $1700, the McLeod RXT comes with a steel flywheel. I assume it isn't a fancy dual mass.

I love the idea of a light rotating assembly, and in fact have used aluminum flywheels in American V8 applications - and the feel of the clutch/car never bothered me at all. However, I hate my current aluminum flywheel and puck clutch. It rattles (apparently very common), chatters and engages violently.

Joel convinced me the McLeod RXT was the way to go in video, which he swears is typical of the McLeod...

[ame]https://youtu.be/jrvGw72fGaw?t=79[/ame]
 

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.

For $1700, the McLeod RXT comes with a steel flywheel. I assume it isn't a fancy dual mass.

I love the idea of a light rotating assembly, and in fact have used aluminum flywheels in American V8 applications - and the feel of the clutch/car never bothered me at all. However, I hate my current aluminum flywheel and puck clutch. It rattles (apparently very common), chatters and engages violently.

Joel convinced me the McLeod RXT was the way to go in video, which he swears is typical of the McLeod...
If you notice in the video, none of the clutch disks have spring dampers, which seems strange since I thought they were used for vibration dampening to help reduce gear rollover and so forth. But hey, if it works, it works!

I currently have Fidanza's lightweight flywheel ready to be installed soon, I wonder how it's going to be with a stock clutch.
 

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If you notice in the video, none of the clutch disks don't have spring dampers, which seems strange since I thought they were used for vibration dampening to help reduce gear rollover and so forth. But hey, if it works, it works!

I currently have Fidanza's lightweight flywheel ready to be installed soon, I wonder how it's going to be with a stock clutch.
Yes, I also thought it was strange that a "clutch with nice manners" would be unsprung - but like you said, whatever works...

An organic friction disk will go a long ways towards making your engagement characteristics easy to live with for daily driving. The lightweight, non dual-mass 'wheel is going to require a bit more engine speed to avoid bogging when getting rolling, but it won't be bad at all. However, flywheels like these are well known for "clatter", most notably when idling, in neutral with the clutch engaged. It's actually the undamped (non dual mass, and less rotating mass to act as a "mass damper:) torsional vibrations causing the input shaft to clatter against the cluster gear on the countershaft.
 

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Haven't posted in a long time and thought I would chime in, for the OP, as I have owned all the toyota 5 speed and 6 speed manual trans. In regard to the cd09, t56, and ar, I don't have experience with those. I broke 3 w55's , 2w58's , 2 r154's. All of these transmission's have variables on what there limits are. The most import would be what torque level and what type of clutch ie pressure plate, disk material, puck vs disk, driving style, etc...

I am a little harder on parts so my 58's broke between 325-350. I broke the w58's around 450ish and the r154's 560 for one and the other had Marlin Crawler parts 670. I ran my v160 in my first car with no issues, and now with my 2nd IS. But, I had a friend of mine that had issues with his single disk clutch which was iron material and it welded itself. I currently run a RPS Billet twin disk and need to go to a triple disk setup due to making more torque now.

So to sum up, in my opinion, go for a transmission that will handle more torque that what your target goal is for.
 
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