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Discussion Starter #161
the head will come off in the car.
That's good to know Mike - I do have ARP studs.

I probably will not swap on a turbo- I honestly can't imagine that much oil can pass through a .025" restrictor., Rather I'll just pull the engine.

Had a discussion with my machine shop guy today and he concurs with gas-washed rings being the probable cause. There's no blowby and no oil in the turbo compressor. He's offered to take the assembled long block and help me test/ tear down to find the problem.
 

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Sorry to hear Rick, I've been down that road. I had a bad block cause several engine failures, every 200 miles a new motor would start knocking. It wasn't until I started over with a new JSPEC GTE motor that all my problems were a memory. The stock motors will hold gobs of power so there is little need for us to upgrade internals under 800 RWHP.
 

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Discussion Starter #163
Engine came out, teardown revealed bad rings and hone marks in the cylinders almost worn smooth.

Pretty sure that there were two causes: first was me cranking the shit out of it to try and prime the oil pump - Even with the fuel pump turned off -I'm sure that did the rings no good- and then cranking the shit out of it with the fuel pump on to try to start it. Dumb moves both of them.

The engine will get the block cleaned/rehoned and new rings.

I'm very close to getting the engine back together. This time I have a setup and tune I know will start the car. Third time is the one.
 

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goodluck man. extra 10-12% displacement should make for a fun power band
 

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Cranking the piss out of it to prime the oil pump really isn't too detrimental. When you assemble the shortblock make sure to oil the rings and cylinder walls very well. Or if your machine shop already assembled the shortblock just rotate the crank and apply oil to all of the cylinder walls. Do this several times and the walls will be well oiled. After this, it's basically safe to crank away. If the completed engine sits for a long time before it is ready to be fired up. Take a curved syringe and inject oil into the cylinders from the spark plug holes. Rotate the crank as you do this and it will spread the oil around evenly on the walls.

We talked on the phone about this a few months back I think. I told you that on the 2JZ, sometimes no matter what you do the oil pump just will not want to prime. I've had to do this a few times, which is risky to many people but it has worked for me when there was no other way to prime. I just go ahead and start the engine for a split second and then cut it. Seems like the 2JZ oil pump in some stubborn cases does not prime sometimes until you get the RPM to around 450-500rpm. The starter can only do around 250-300rpm. So I will start the engine just barely and then cut it. That usually get it primed instantly.

Honestly, if you are getting the hone marks destroyed it is most likely due to the machine work. Did the machine shop spec the piston tolerances and factor for material expansion? I make my machinist double check everything before I take away the block. I know the specs off the top of my head, so I just get him to measure everything and I write it all down to make sure it is in spec. It sounds like in your case, maybe the wall clearances are off, or they did not set the ring gap correctly. Both are extremely important and can cause the problems you had. Are they a shop that builds a lot of 2JZ or is it just a normal shop. I know a lot of domestic machine shops will just use the same clearance specs they use on their v8's when building import engines. Obviously it's not going to work out because the clearances are way tighter in import engines.
 

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Discussion Starter #166
Yep, I never did get the oil pressure up by cranking but when it finally did start I had instant pressure. I did check the wall clearances after machining and set the ring gaps myself - the Venolia pistons I use are set at a fairly large clearance. Didn't give the cylinders any extra oil before all this cranking - I really think that the fuel washdown was the culprit. When it finally did start, the engine smoked badly from the beginning, even before it had a chance to warm up and expand the rings out to their max size and wear the walls.

Like I said, I'm ready to get this thing going again.
 

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Rick's back. Registered as mojoperf now after difficulty with the old registration.
Finally running. The third set of pistons/rings was the charm, as the ones provided by my stroker kit builder never did work. For this one I took the liberty of installing .260 wall wrist pins as well as Total Seal Steel rings. Still Venolia forged stroker pistons to my calculations/spec, 8.5 compression for use with stock length rods. I don't know if I will ever go E85, as 1. none available within 40 miles 2. Fuel system maintenance looks troublesome, 3.I don't need more power as traction control kicks in lots with 265/35-18 Michelin pilot super sports.
I love this setup! Now with a ported head w/ +1 mm valves, HKS 272 cams, OSGiken triple, and a BW EFR9180.
For the latest startup I filled the oil pump with STP and got instant oil pressure off the starter.
Working on the MS3 Pro tune, all good except for some tricky places in the just off-idle areas, probably difficult due to the cam and big throttle body.
More later, I'm off to a meet.
 

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I'll start over with a build thread with pictures soon.
A priority is getting the fuel gauge to work - almost ran out of gas today. I have installed an IGF simulator, working on a circuit to take the MAP sensor output and scale it to mimic the stock MAF signal.
 

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Rick's back. Registered as mojoperf now after difficulty with the old registration.
Finally running. The third set of pistons/rings was the charm, as the ones provided by my stroker kit builder never did work. For this one I took the liberty of installing .260 wall wrist pins as well as Total Seal Steel rings. Still Venolia forged stroker pistons to my calculations/spec, 8.5 compression for use with stock length rods. I don't know if I will ever go E85, as 1. none available within 40 miles 2. Fuel system maintenance looks troublesome, 3.I don't need more power as traction control kicks in lots with 265/35-18 Michelin pilot super sports.
I love this setup! Now with a ported head w/ +1 mm valves, HKS 272 cams, OSGiken triple, and a BW EFR9180.
For the latest startup I filled the oil pump with STP and got instant oil pressure off the starter.
Working on the MS3 Pro tune, all good except for some tricky places in the just off-idle areas, probably difficult due to the cam and big throttle body.
More later, I'm off to a meet.

Awesome Rick. Glad to hear its up and running again.
 

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Belated update:
This car has run me out of money. The stroker motors never did work out -probably because of the piston/ring combos provided by PAECO - after the 3rd unsuccessful rebuild I finally refreshed my original 3.0 GE with turbo pistons and Eagle rods, and put it together with my worked VVTI head, HKS 272 cams, and a BW 9180 EFR. It was crazy fast until my V160 decided to refuse to select gears. I'm done , will be selling the car. I will post in the cars for sale area when I get permissions sorted out. This is a sad time - I love this car, but it has to go.
 

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Belated update:
This car has run me out of money. The stroker motors never did work out -probably because of the piston/ring combos provided by PAECO - after the 3rd unsuccessful rebuild I finally refreshed my original 3.0 GE with turbo pistons and Eagle rods, and put it together with my worked VVTI head, HKS 272 cams, and a BW 9180 EFR. It was crazy fast until my V160 decided to refuse to select gears. I'm done , will be selling the car. I will post in the cars for sale area when I get permissions sorted out. This is a sad time - I love this car, but it has to go.
What keeps happening with the stroker kit?
 

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With the stroker, I never could get the rings to seal - and it seems like there was some issue with block oiling. The ring sealing problem I lay on the pistons that were provided - The block oiling I have no idea. The block had its plugs removed and boiled out at the machine shop - all clearances checked good - maybe some issue with the crank? I have built many engines, and never had problems like this.
 

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With the stroker, I never could get the rings to seal - and it seems like there was some issue with block oiling. The ring sealing problem I lay on the pistons that were provided - The block oiling I have no idea. The block had its plugs removed and boiled out at the machine shop - all clearances checked good - maybe some issue with the crank? I have built many engines, and never had problems like this.
Okay, Just wondering. Yeah I have seen oiling issues on motors if the galleries were not right. Also with cranks not drilled properly for oiling. As for rings sealing. Do not know. The only time I have run across that was one of the 5 inch bore race motors. But we got it by changing the roughness of the cylinder and getting it pretty hot. Sorry for you issues.
 
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