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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
last attempt before i give up and ship it off to SRT....


for the past few weeks.. been trying to get my car started after a lengthy project. heres a quick rundown to get you guys up to date...

in august of 06, after lexfest, i broke my 4th tranny. in the week it was down, i had another w58 ready to go in, but decided it was time to put my gte internals that had been sitting in the garage for the past year.

in the process of doing the gte internals, i decided to add a few more projects. we installed some gte cams, both intake and exhaust. got rid of vvti... added 870cc low impedence injectors, haltech e6x, haltech ignitor, 3 bar map sensor, tial 50mm bov, redo ic piping, got rid of the maf, got rid of the stock ignitor, swapped in a r154, and list goes on...

more recently... we finally decided to try and start it.. after a few cranks, noticed there were a few leaks. we fixed most of them.. only thing left is to replace the lower oil pan, which will be done once i get a new one from LexISpooled... still waiting to hear back from him...

after a few hours of trying to connect to the haltech, it finally connected, with the assistance of Mo and SRT, i was given a base map for my application and was told it should be able to start. we tried and were denied access lol. the car turns, but won't fire. we checked for spark.. and no spark.

after brainstorming and trying to troubleshoot the problem.. and getting nowhere.. i decided to give Mo another call.

i also want to state that i don't know why people can't get through to SRT... i've called them so many times and 90% of the time, they answer the phone. so i don't get it when people complain they can't get in touch with them when over the past 4 years or so, i've always been able to get in touch with them. also want to thank SRT and Mo for all the help trying to troubleshoot the problem over the phone... and no, i don't have an SRT kit, but i have purchased a few items from them over the years. thats what i call incredible customer service and support!!!

okay back on topic...

after speaking with Mo, he suggested that i disconnect the ignitor (which i may have fried in the process) and search for an rpm signal instead of spark only to realize i couldn't find it. we hooked up the haltech.. cranked the car and no rpm signal at all. we checked the wiring of the signal conditioner box and everything was correct based on the wiring diagram SRT provided. hoping it may have been just a defective box, i sent it back to SRT to have them inspect it. w/o any delay, as soon as it arrived at SRT i received a phone call and was told they would be shipping me back a brand new unit!! there was no evidence that anything was wrong with the last one, but they knew my car was in a shop and tried to provide the best support possible w/o me having to lose too much time. MUCH APPRECIATED!!

unfortuantely, after receiving the new signal conditioner and installing it, still no rpm signal.. i checked the crank trigger and made sure all the connections were in fact connected.. still no rpm signal.

so thats pretty much where im at. according to Mo, there is no need to search for spark until i can find an RPM signal which i can't... so im stuck.

im trying to locate an oscilloscope locally to see if we can trace some of the wires to see if there is a bad connection somewhere. if we are unsuccessful with this final attempt... im done. i will at that point either ship the car to SRT and have them finish the job or sell the car as is.

any input or suggestions are highly welcome. thanks for your time.
 

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ok, I had the exact same problem......My installer opened up the signal conditioner box only to find out that there were wires that had not been soldered. Open up that box & check it out. After he soldered those wires I got a rpm signal, crank trigger signal and spark!!!! and then it started.

.....Then I found out it got wired it for low impedance injectors when I have high impedance. anyway ...ordering the 870's from SRT now......

Best of luck!!
 

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oh, forgot to ask you....did you just "drop" in those GTE internals like in De's post "how to drop in GTE internals" no need to hone the cylinders ect....

I am thinking about doing the head gasket & while im in there.......well you know. Just don't want to have to take the block to the machine shop if I don't have to...??
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
ok, I had the exact same problem......My installer opened up the signal conditioner box only to find out that there were wires that had not been soldered. Open up that box & check it out. After he soldered those wires I got a rpm signal, crank trigger signal and spark!!!! and then it started.

.....Then I found out it got wired it for low impedance injectors when I have high impedance. anyway ...ordering the 870's from SRT now......

Best of luck!!
well i guess i can take a look at the box... but i just sent my old box back to SRT and upon their visual inspection, they could see nothing wrong with it. i got the new box in yesterday and installed it today only to have the same problem. i wish it could be so simple... but i guess it won't hurt to open it up and check...

so did he change it because you were running high impedence injectors? a little confused....
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
oh, forgot to ask you....did you just "drop" in those GTE internals like in De's post "how to drop in GTE internals" no need to hone the cylinders ect....

I am thinking about doing the head gasket & while im in there.......well you know. Just don't want to have to take the block to the machine shop if I don't have to...??
i didn't use de's guide... but yeah.. pretty much just dropped them in... used new rings and new bearings... checked the clearances... but thats about it. i dont know if i did it right... it was the first time i attempted something like this... seems like it has compression, but i won't know for sure till i get it running lol
 

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Keep me in the loop as I want to be able to just "drop em in". :)

as for the injectors....I had had high impedance in there already and SRT's instructions were meant for their 870 LOW impedance ones so I'm just ditching my high impedance ones as I would be upgrading eventually anyway!

P.S. how hard was it to check clearances? I take it you are reffering to "valve to piston" clearance. and were those just stock GTE cams? Just drop em in too? well follow the oem repair manual for "head removal". I have already read this one :)

sorry for the 50 questions but it's like 6 months of questions in my head answered in 5 minutes!!
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
to be honest.. im probably not the best person to ask..lol

it was my first build and i still don't know if we did it right... so with that being said... good luck!! :D


anyone else have an opinions or ideas on what to do with my car?
 

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oh, forgot to ask you....did you just "drop" in those GTE internals like in De's post "how to drop in GTE internals" no need to hone the cylinders ect....

I am thinking about doing the head gasket & while im in there.......well you know. Just don't want to have to take the block to the machine shop if I don't have to...??
To answer your question, you don't have to hone the block if there is nothing wrong with the engine (no spun bearing and etc..) Just check for clearance and get the right sized bearings. You can do it just like DE had it in his post. I have built/put back together several 2jz's and have done them all this way and till this day it has perfect compression and still runs.

Good Luck
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
ok.. guess im going to prep it to take to SRT since i am left no choice... not that its a bad thing... but bad for my wallet lol


im actually excited to let Mo work on it... he's never steered me wrong and i know he will get it right!! but on the small chance i could get it fixed on my own would be much more rewarding.... ahhhhhh
 

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Well..hope it's just something simple Lexotic. Best of luck to ya.

02SilverIS - You have just convinced me to upgrade my internals this winter!!!!! Just need to learn how to "check those clearances" The rest I pretty much got it covered. I googled it and got to a chevy site where a guy used some play dough somehow between the valve and the cylinder and checked the clearance from the play dough. there is a specific distance from the intake valve at 10 degrees above? TDC and for the exhaust valve at 10 degrees below TDC or vice versa...somthing like that. Am I way in left field??? do you have any internet links to learn how this goes?
 

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Lexotic Concepts - Did you check if everything was plugged in correctly and did you ever get a new igniter or borrow someone elses to see if that helped out? Sorry that it got off topic but I was trying to help out others as well.

Rockinrobbieredstar - It tells you how to measure everything in the service manual, you can download it for free on this site someone hosted it awhile back.

Good luck to both of you and keep us updated.
 

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well the first logical thing to do is find the wires for the crank sensor, back probe them with a t pin and see if yuor getting any voltage from the sensor. If you are then trace it back to the haltech following the flow of current. Whereveer you drop voltage is your problem. Maybe the new ignitor is interfering with the crank signal. theres too many possiblities your probly betetr off letting them handel it...since they have the resources.

P.s

O-scopes rule
 

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I would go back to basics with the electrical part of your install.
Any thing in and around the ignitor could be the problem.

Also, what ecu pin are you using for your RPM Signal?
B16 "tach to meter (rpm)"

Keep it simple, only 7 pins to wire.
Stock Ignitor:
Pin 1-Coil Negative #1.
Pin 2-ECU Ignition Output #1.
Pin 3-Coil Negative #3.
Pin 4-Chassis Ground.
Pin 5-ECU Ignition Output #3.
Pin 6-Coil Negative #2.
Pin 7-ECU Ignition Output #2.

Haltech 3ch Ignitor:
Coil 1 negative --> C1 wire on stock igniter (pin 1)
Coil 2 negative --> C2 wire on stock igniter (pin 6)
Coil 3 negative --> C3 wire on stock igniter (pin 3)
ECU Ignition #1 --> IGN 1 wire for Haltech (pin 2)
ECU Ignition #2 --> IGN 2 wire for Haltech (pin 7)
ECU Ignition #3 --> IGN 3 wire for Haltech (pin 5)
Ground --> Solid ground location on chassis. (pin 4)

I'm sure Mo told you this but here it is again...Not sure of the reasoning here:

NOTE: Very important to not try to power up the system with the Haltech
igniter plugged in. Please load the base map FIRST, then REMOVE the key
from the ignition for about 30 seconds then plug in the igniter.


Crank Trigger signal box:


Other areas to cover just to be certain:
Low impedance injectors:
Ign1 - Cyl 1,6
Ign2 - Cyl 2,5
Ign3 - Cyl 3,4
Inj1 - Cyl 1,5
Inj2 - Cyl 3
Inj3 - Cyl 6,2
Inj4 - Cyl 4
Set the software for Inj 1,3 @ 8 Amps, and Inj 2,4 @ 4 Amps. Ignition divide by 3.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
will def. go over the wiring again again... did it a few times already, but the 5th time could be the charm.. ;)

btw.. for the last line you wrote.. ignition divide by 3? a little confused......
 

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I know about the 5th time charm (or 9th time charm), I had issues with my F10x long ago because I was dumb and bought it used...hacked to shit.
Ignition divide by 3 is your setting that correlates to the drivers/amps you are using from the way you wired ign/injection. For every three

The way I understand it - Ignition divide by is set to half the number of cylinders. In doing this you get 1.5 injections per cycle so with w/ 6cyl you get 3 events per cycle, 3 full rotations of the crank.

There are a couple threads where Mo and Claudio (haltech guy) go back and forth on ign/inj driver setups. Multi vs Batch


***Edit, WTF, my reply got cut off**** ^^^^Cliffs Notes^^
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
hah... 9th time eh? then you should understand the pain all too well lol... thanks again for the help. i'll let you know how things go.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
and im still a little confused about that last part.. but i'll have colin read this over and im sure it will make sense to him
 

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hah... 9th time eh? then you should understand the pain all too well lol... thanks again for the help. i'll let you know how things go.
Sorry, my reply got cutoff.
And yeah, I hope to NOT be in the same boat this time around..Doing an Aristo swap w/ E6x so troubleshooting will be a wiring nightmare. :)
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
well good luck with that bro.. and thanks for the insight!
 
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