Lexus IS Forum banner

1 - 20 of 35 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
113 Posts
Originally posted by Doug:
As per a challenge from Swift Racing aka Muhammed, here is a link to a well known tuner offering an intake upgrade for your IS, hope it will save you a little money.
http://www.rodmillenstore.com/is_300/price.htm

Doug, Doug, Doug, you haven't been doing your homework. Everyone says that this intake makes your car Slower not Faster. $300 is a waste on the RMM intake.
Swift Racing (1)
Doug (0)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,372 Posts
Discussion Starter #4
Do you have an RC51?? If you do the score is reversed.

Doug 1
RC51 0

Next question, when is your Swift intake arriving?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
36 Posts
I have question, has anybody actually measured the acceleration times with the Swift Intake?
I've seen the power measurement charts posted earlier, but these are at rest and, as I understand, over a short period of time.

As far as I have seen, RMM intake also claims increase in peak power.

Has anybody tried just the intake with no computer upgrade vs. intake + computer upgrade?

[This message has been edited by West (edited November 29, 2000).]
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
442 Posts
Ok, this might just be me but I don't think there would be a difference between the short arm intakes. I think that the increase comes from everything combined but with just an intake I think it would have the same results as the RMM one. It's just a cone, and arm...nothing too different than the RMM one, if it was a cold air then things might be different.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
12,157 Posts
that intake has the same basic design as the SR one, but the reason SR could make more power is because it has an ecu that is tuned to take in more air, since the piping volume is increased, the afm or ecu has to be tuned for that, or you can get larger injectors that are increased in flow volume, the same as the intake/afm tube was increased in flow volume.

the second is an old trick that the 7mgte supra crowd does with there stock afm bolted on to a lexus afm housing. the lexus afm allows 25% more air to go through and since the afm wasn't designed to read for that, they also upgrade to 550cc injectors, which is approximately a 25% increase in fuel delivery, which balances out the increase in air going into the motor.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
113 Posts
Originally posted by Doug:
Do you have an RC51?? If you do the score is reversed.

Doug 1
RC51 0

Next question, when is your Swift intake arriving?
Doug, Yes I have an RC51. I own many bikes. Why do you ask "If I have an RC51, the score should be reversed?" Don't tell me you ride too?
I was really hoping that you would find a cheaper solution than the Swift Intake, then you go and tell us that the RMM is better and cheaper? Cheaper yes, better, according to everyone here, no way.
I have not actually ordered the Swift intake yet? I don't have $800.00 to just give up for an intake, I am just waiting for my TRD sway bars to arrive and maybe a supercharger when ready, that's it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,372 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
I have an R1 and a CR250. I had wanted an RC51 as I 've never had a V-twin, kinda lost interest when I saw the hp and weight difference.

I am going out of my way to point out some options for you guys cause I think $800 for the Swift product is really out there. The Stillen product looks virtually identical, so the question now is the ECU mod worth $500 and why would lexus use an airflow meter that could not compensate for increased volume????

By the way, I don't think I made the claim of better, just cheaper.

[This message has been edited by Doug (edited November 30, 2000).]
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
113 Posts
Originally posted by Doug:
I have an R1 and a CR250. I had wanted an RC51 as I 've never had a V-twin, kinda lost interest when I saw the hp and weight difference.

I am going out of my way to point out some options for you guys cause I think $800 for the Swift product is really out there. The Stillen product looks virtually identical, so the question now is the ECU mod worth $500 and why would lexus use an airflow meter that could not compensate for increased volume????

By the way, I don't think I made the claim of better, just cheaper.

[This message has been edited by Doug (edited November 30, 2000).]

R1, great bike...Had to get an RC51. let me tell you when you go to a twin, you won't go back to fours. LOVE the bike, can't feel the weight, only through the very tight stuff. The power is unreal, nobody can pull on me even with the extra weight. The RC is VERY solid through the turns, begs to go faster, first bike that made me feel that way.
Also own 94' 900RR (Erion Racing set-up) a 97 F3 (trakc bike, that (Eric Bostrom rode in his 97 season with Erion racing)
Selling that one though $7000 firm. an 99F4.
Anyways, I agree with you Doug, $800 is a little steep for this mod, I agree quality products come at a price, compared to bikes, it's actually CHEAP. $2500 AKRO full system etc..you know what I mean, titanium this, carbon fiber that. SO for the Swift Racing I guess the ECU is the key to the power, makes sense. It all depends what you are after I guess? Compared to bikes a $200 slip-on for the noise or a $2000 full system for the 15hp gain? You decide.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
12,157 Posts
i don't think you are understanding. the ecu/afm can compensate for increased air flow, but when you change the housing size, it will compensate for the amount of air it reads, not for the extra air getting buy that it won't read. the ecu/afm parameters are based on a certain diameter of piping. it reads the air temp and volume through a honeycomb that straightens the air, and then a final black post sticking in the air that converts the air measurements to an electronic signal for the ecu to read. this electronic signal is then plugged into a calculation based on approximately 2.75" piping. when the pipe size is increased, the afm is going to do the same thing, and send the same air temp and volume signals, and the computer is going to make calculations based on the 2.75" piping which is programmed in as a given. the only way to get around this is to program the computer to makes its calculations based on the size of piping you upgrade to, and that is what the SR ecu does, i am assuming.

put it this way, you have a pipe with a measurement gauge, it measure temp and pressure. a computer plugs those measurements into an equation based on 3" pvc piping an comes up with a volume of how much water is traveling through the pipe (even though water doesn't compress like air, i know, but just assume it has all of airs properties for this example)
now, if you change the size of the piping to 5" and use the same sensor, the sensor is going to send the same pressure reading and temp reading to the same computer which will plug it into the same equation. which will be wrong, because even though the sensor will see the same readings as before, the last part of the equation plugin, which is in the monitoring computer is incorrect. the only way to compensate for this would be to go into the computer and change that part of the equation to 5" piping instead of 3" piping. otherwise your readings will be all messed up and wrong.
same thing with the IS's afm and ecu. hope this came across as informative and useful, instead of babbling?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
36 Posts
Wow... great explanation IS300GTE. Thanks.
I have another question - as far as I understand, the O2 sensor acts as a direct feed back control when the it is up to operating temp.
Wouldn't it be easier for the ECU to simply adjust fuel by how much oxygen is left in the exhaust rather than eyeball it from its afm? How does oxygen sensor come into the equation?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,858 Posts
Doug,
I guess you missed the challenge by a longshot, I said prove to me that there is an intake cheaper that produces the same results not just a cheaper intake that does not perform. If you look closely to our intake and the RMM unit you will see some major differences in design, ex. larger piping, CNC machined MAF housing vs. welded pieces, etc. So you are at it again and do not know what you are saying, people in this board already knew about the RMM intake, and there was even someone that said his car slowed down by 0.4 sec in the 1/4 mi. and others that got check engine lights, so I guess you are not doing YOUR homework properly. BTW we already knew exactly how much RMM was selling their intake for, they are our competitors. AND one last thing you STILL do not know how to spell my name properly, how would you feel if someone spelt you name as D I C K instead of D O U G.

IS300GTE are you sure you are not one of my employees? Do you need a job? LOL, neways that was a good explanation. There was one little difference though the honeycome you describe is for the older types of MAF sensors (pre OBDII or cars before 1995), on the newer cars there is no honey comb and the sensor output signal is quite different. The older OBDI cars used frequency for the calculation of flow thus the air needed to be perfectly straight, on the newer cars they use the thermal hot wire sensors and as long as it is lined up straight with the direction of flow of air you are good to go, however the sensor has to be perfectly aligned otherwise you will run into inconsistenties especially when you make housings that are welded in place like those made by our competitors. Even though welding is about five times cheaper than CNC machining IMO you should not take any shortcuts in product quality.

WEST the O2 sensors are after the fact sensors and the MAF sensor is before the face, i.e. the MAF sensor tells the ECU how much air is going into the engine so that the ECU can provide the required amount of fuel, then after combustion the O2 sensors feedback to the ecu if the combustion was stoichiometric or rich or lean, and the ECU calibrates the air-fuel ratio accordingly, however there is a catch, the ECU can only adjust minute differences over a period of time and if it can't then you get a MIL code (check engine light). So O2 sensors are useful mainly for emmissions control, and useful when tuning a car. A good example would be as you drive your car, your intake system becomes less efficient over time as things like the throttle body and valves become dirty, the ECU can compensate for this over a sustained period of time from feedback from the O2 sensor but you should also note that the MAF sensor is also detecting some reduction in volume of air intake. Basically the adjustment level is there but just for very small changes and it is not optimized for performance but rather optimized to meet emmissions.

------------------
Muhammad I. Choudhury
Swift Racing Technologies
www.swift-racing.com
[email protected]

[This message has been edited by Swift Racing Technologies (edited November 30, 2000).]
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,372 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
I still disagree Muhammed, spelling someone's name incorrectly could just be interpreted as being disrespectful. What do you think?

You can bitch and moan all you want, but my guess is that Stillen, who actually has a reputation, probably makes an identical claim about his product.

Just to make it crystal clear for you, since selective reading seems to be one of your attributes. I think your product, even if it does produce 12hp, is overpriced, and I did in fact find a cheaper product, which I still contend would statistically match your claims. In addition, I only found one, undoubtedly there are more. I am glad that you FEEL like you are the only person making performance products for Toyota products.

By the way, would you rely on one guys opinion of your product? especially if it was negative? Why are you guys so quick to accept that the RMM piece is not good. seems to me that they would dyno their product before releasing it, wouldn't you think.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
291 Posts
Hey guys...I'm really sick of this topic being bashed around.

Bottom line:

* Yes. the SRT intake price is higher than most competitors but please, look at the QUALITY - this will last a long long time and is very flexible to other blueprint/internal modifications to the IS. I would not have provided SRT my car after I bought the RMM Intake if the RMM intake was so good.

* Maybe. The RMM Intake would be better ONLY if it is coupled with other add'l. modifications (i.e. NOS, turbo, etc.). PLUS, D O U G, as a car enthusiast, you have mentioned earlier that RMM would not sell their intake without previously placing it on a dyno...WHERE ARE THE RESULTS? I want to see it. I will also place a challenge...get me a stock IS300 with the RMM intake and I will race them 1/4 mile to see results - 3 times.

I shall wait for a challenger.

o LAST CHALLENGE: I will be meeting with a few IS owners from DC/Va/MD to show the intake and to let them take a spin of my car around the block. I will ask these people to POST their feedback here.

**To each his own...we decide to purchase different possessions based on our OWN likings. I like the SRT. It works well. It's priced decent. WHEN another competitor comes out with a good quality intake, ecu and outputs 12hps...I can then switch.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,858 Posts
Thanks Jebo,
But Doughboy is a non IS owner, who does selective reading himself and is the one who is doing all the bitchin and moanin himself.

Well like you said, enough said, this is similar to the situation that happened with the introduction of the GS4 intake months ago where there were skeptics and competitors that tried to bash our products and as more and more people bought the intake, at the end SRT came up on top with an amazing 100% of customers satisfied and customers that have tested and claimed a reduction of upto 0.2 seconds in the 0-60mph and 0.3seconds in the 1/4 mi.

Bye Dough or should I say Douche, no no no better yet I believe you are best suited when called Dour, yes that is it, DOUR. Oh yes quick run and get your dictionary.


------------------
Muhammad I. Choudhury
Swift Racing Technologies
www.swift-racing.com
[email protected]
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
12,157 Posts
thank you thank you i try, and once in a while i suceed! : )

Originally posted by RC51:
IS300GTE...I concur. Boy that WAS an explaination alright. Makes sense. Couldn't have said it any better
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
12,157 Posts
ditto as above

as for the O2 sensor, it is an after the fact equation that is used by the ecu. the o2 sensor is used to adjust the air to fuel ratio. it only has certain limited values that it can adjust for, and is not that accurate always. the afm measures all air coming in, and knows its density based on its tempatures.

the O2 is basically like doing a check equation on a math equation. the O2 sensor checks how accurate the air fuel ratio levels are to its preprogrammed table, that was originally governed by the afm signal the ecu receives. one is a checksum for another.

Originally posted by West:
Wow... great explanation IS300GTE. Thanks.
I have another question - as far as I understand, the O2 sensor acts as a direct feed back control when the it is up to operating temp.
Wouldn't it be easier for the ECU to simply adjust fuel by how much oxygen is left in the exhaust rather than eyeball it from its afm? How does oxygen sensor come into the equation?
 
1 - 20 of 35 Posts
Top