PSA: Proper winter tires are more important than all-wheel drive - Lexus IS Forum
User Tag List

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 24 (permalink) Old 12-29-2009, 01:57 PM Thread Starter
Deity
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Maryland
Posts: 12,111
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
           
PSA: Proper winter tires are more important than all-wheel drive

Quote:
Originally Posted by AutoBlog
With the adoption of front-wheel drive as the mainstream power delivery system of choice, the semi-annual ritual of swapping snow tires has largely disappeared for most Americans. In many northern areas, all-wheel drive has become an increasingly popular choice when offered as an option. But as much help as putting power through all four wheels can be, it simply can't substitute for a good set of snow tires.

Ultimately, grip comes down to four patches of rubber and if they're unable to make solid contact, the number of drive wheels becomes irrelevant. This became abundantly clear this past weekend while driving a new 2010 Subaru Legacy. The Legacy is a plush, roomy mid-size sedan with excellent outward visibility and Subaru makes an excellent symmetrical all wheel drive. Unfortunately, its all-season tires lacked traction. Read on after the jump for more.


On dry pavement all-wheel drive can be a major boon by splitting the tractive workload and leaving the front wheels to take handle steering. In the snowy conditions we endured this past weekend, it can also help claw its way through the snow. However, most cars can put out more drive torque than the tires can transmit. That means it's not at hard to spin up all four wheels when accelerating, at least until the traction control kicks in.
Now as much as we enjoy to exploit slip angles, it's best to keep the car within the limits of adhesion. Lack of grip is a fundamental problem with all season rubber and all-wheel drive won't help you get around an icy corner or halt forward progress at a stop sign. Without traction, the Subaru still had trouble turning and it was pretty easy to get sideways before the stability management kicked in.

The only solution to is fit tires that maximize grip in these conditions. All the major tire manufacturers produce winter tires and we highly recommend them to anyone living in areas subject to snowy winters no matter how many wheels are driven. The easiest thing to do is just by an extra set of rims and have the tires mounted. When winter arrives, put on the snows and stack the summer tires in the corner of the garage or basement, then reverse the process in the spring. It's money well spent, and certainly cheaper than body repairs and hiked up insurance premiums.
PSA: Proper winter tires are more important than all-wheel drive — Autoblog

Quote:
Originally Posted by beefytee View Post
did he just suicide bomb our f^*@*#^ parking lot?
Quote:
Originally Posted by magoo View Post
Don't even ask. This kid defies logic.
-=Hot|Ice=- is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 24 (permalink) Old 12-29-2009, 02:19 PM
Penetration Specialist
 
Wino_II's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 23,689
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
           
tis true. unless you got winter tires on an awd car.

©2006 my.IS
Wino_II
Wino_II is offline  
post #3 of 24 (permalink) Old 12-29-2009, 03:03 PM
Guru
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 8,107
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
           
i think awd cars require more skill to drive in snow also - at least our WRX is that way. Let off the gas and the car goes from snow cat to sled in an instant.

We have Nokian all-seasons on the WRX, they're awesome, though maybe not as good as a good snow tire.
ckolsen is offline  
post #4 of 24 (permalink) Old 12-29-2009, 03:09 PM
Exclusive Agent
 
JayMarino's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: at the office
Posts: 3,582
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
           
I have had a set of Blizzak LM-60s for a few years now, and they are fantastic.
We drove through one of the largest blizzards we have had all year last saturday and I had no problems.

...........:::::::: Jay Marino ::::::::...............
..... 2005 Lexus ES330 (current beater) ......
.............. 2013 Lexus CT200h (sold) ..........
.......... 2003 GGP SportDesign (sold)...........
.......... 2002 DWP IS300 Turbo (sold)..........
JayMarino is offline  
post #5 of 24 (permalink) Old 12-29-2009, 04:58 PM
Technical Poseur
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Rapid City, SD
Posts: 23,313
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 31 Post(s)
           
Sadly this isnt common sense. Its how I go flying past SUVs in 3-4 inches of snow on the freeway in complete control

Poster, I mean poster. What have I done?
-Tom- is offline  
post #6 of 24 (permalink) Old 12-29-2009, 05:12 PM
\/ Awesome \/
 
ItalynStylion's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Irving, Tx.
Posts: 11,394
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
           
Quote:
Originally Posted by -Tom- View Post
Sadly this isnt common sense. Its how I go flying past SUVs in 3-4 inches of snow on the freeway in complete control
Yeah, AWD in the snow only helps you GO but it doesn't help you stop or turn on ice.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DJPoop View Post
This is the future of engine technology. There is a replacement for displacement, and it's called efficiency.
ItalynStylion is offline  
post #7 of 24 (permalink) Old 12-29-2009, 06:17 PM
Immortal
 
Crester's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 27,116
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
           
It's true that winter tires are very important. AWD only helps you get going in snow... it doesn't help you stop. A lot of people think AWD automatically makes them invincible in the snow!

But that being said... I drove an Impreza with all seasons in a snow storm and that car went better than my IS300 with winter tires on!

.
.
I really wanna be a racecar driver... :-/

2001 IS300 MSM | EIBACH | BORLA | FIGS | VALEO | PIONEER | JOE Z | EAGLE F1 GS-D3 | LSD | STOPTECH | BILSTEIN | AFE POWER | POWERSLOT | 5000K | OZ ULTRALEGGERA | HARD RACE
Crester is offline  
post #8 of 24 (permalink) Old 12-30-2009, 12:16 PM
Addict
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: USA
Posts: 2,628
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
           
AWD, for 99% of people, is unnecessary and absurd. All you need to drive on snowy roads is good snow tires. 4WD is only needed when going off-road.
hasanazhar is offline  
post #9 of 24 (permalink) Old 12-30-2009, 12:26 PM
Extremist
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: WA-SHEENG-TIN
Posts: 5,442
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
           
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crester View Post
But that being said... I drove an Impreza with all seasons in a snow storm and that car went better than my IS300 with winter tires on!
My Impreza still drives better in the snow with piece of shit tires on than my SX w/dedicated snow tires. lol I always take the sx to the slopes but overall feel more in control with the Suby on compact snow covered roads. Ice though.....both fail....solution to that is studs...but I hate studs.

2005 MSM Sportcross: 4/10/09-12/4/13-Gone but Never Forgotten
2012 VW Sportwagen TDI SOLD
2014 Subaru Forester XT SOLD
2007 Saab 9-5 Sportcombi Aero SOLD
2015 VW Tiguan
1998 Lexus LX470
sway162 is offline  
post #10 of 24 (permalink) Old 12-30-2009, 12:27 PM
Immortal
 
Crester's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 27,116
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
           
Quote:
Originally Posted by hasanazhar View Post
AWD, for 99% of people, is unnecessary and absurd. All you need to drive on snowy roads is good snow tires. 4WD is only needed when going off-road.

But sadly... the car world is about what people want versus what they need.

Do you need 19" rims from factory on your minivan??? Probably not... but now you can buy then like that.

.
.
I really wanna be a racecar driver... :-/

2001 IS300 MSM | EIBACH | BORLA | FIGS | VALEO | PIONEER | JOE Z | EAGLE F1 GS-D3 | LSD | STOPTECH | BILSTEIN | AFE POWER | POWERSLOT | 5000K | OZ ULTRALEGGERA | HARD RACE
Crester is offline  
post #11 of 24 (permalink) Old 12-30-2009, 12:29 PM Thread Starter
Deity
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Maryland
Posts: 12,111
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
           
Crester, What type of setup are you running on your car? Have you gotten a lot of snow this season?

Quote:
Originally Posted by beefytee View Post
did he just suicide bomb our f^*@*#^ parking lot?
Quote:
Originally Posted by magoo View Post
Don't even ask. This kid defies logic.
-=Hot|Ice=- is offline  
post #12 of 24 (permalink) Old 12-30-2009, 12:35 PM
Immortal
 
Crester's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 27,116
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
           
Quote:
Originally Posted by sway162 View Post
My Impreza still drives better in the snow with piece of shit tires on than my SX w/dedicated snow tires. lol I always take the sx to the slopes but overall feel more in control with the Suby on compact snow covered roads. Ice though.....both fail....solution to that is studs...but I hate studs.
I never had the pleasure of driving on studs... what's the problem again? On dry pavement the car becomes skiddish?

.
.
I really wanna be a racecar driver... :-/

2001 IS300 MSM | EIBACH | BORLA | FIGS | VALEO | PIONEER | JOE Z | EAGLE F1 GS-D3 | LSD | STOPTECH | BILSTEIN | AFE POWER | POWERSLOT | 5000K | OZ ULTRALEGGERA | HARD RACE
Crester is offline  
post #13 of 24 (permalink) Old 12-30-2009, 12:44 PM
Immortal
 
Crester's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 27,116
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
           
Quote:
Originally Posted by -=Hot|Ice=- View Post
Crester, What type of setup are you running on your car? Have you gotten a lot of snow this season?
Toronto doesn't get much snow. Basically what happens is you have dry days... dry days... and more dry days... and then suddenly you get DUMPED ON with snow. Then that snow slowly goes away... and then it's dry for another long period of time before you get dumped on again. So for that reason I decided to try performance winter tires for the first time this year.

I got Toyo Garit KX's... and loving them so far. In the two small snow falls we had so far this winter they seem to be working well. Not as much grip from a stop that I had with the Nokians... but still good. But what amazes me is that you can drive these tires so hard... it's unbelievable. Infact many times I forget I'm driving on winters. No mushy handling or loud noises.

.
.
I really wanna be a racecar driver... :-/

2001 IS300 MSM | EIBACH | BORLA | FIGS | VALEO | PIONEER | JOE Z | EAGLE F1 GS-D3 | LSD | STOPTECH | BILSTEIN | AFE POWER | POWERSLOT | 5000K | OZ ULTRALEGGERA | HARD RACE
Crester is offline  
post #14 of 24 (permalink) Old 12-30-2009, 01:20 PM
Extremist
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: WA-SHEENG-TIN
Posts: 5,442
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
           
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crester View Post
I never had the pleasure of driving on studs... what's the problem again? On dry pavement the car becomes skiddish?
I had studs on my 240sx a while back. It was my fault for not really researching on it. At that time, I never used that car for the slopes and it mainly drove on dry cold pavement in the winter. I am sure you know that studs on a snow tire is the best solution for compact snow and ice roadways (besides chains). The more studs on a tire the better ice performance and therefore the worse the dry pavement performance. Driving with studs on dry pavement just sounded hideous in the 240 and boy the handling was a nightmare....because you do not have much contact with the rubber. The biggest reason though was the noise....I am probably exaggerating on the handling but it was skiddish and wobbly. Then again though....I remember having on cheapo winter tires...That may have been an issue as well.

2005 MSM Sportcross: 4/10/09-12/4/13-Gone but Never Forgotten
2012 VW Sportwagen TDI SOLD
2014 Subaru Forester XT SOLD
2007 Saab 9-5 Sportcombi Aero SOLD
2015 VW Tiguan
1998 Lexus LX470
sway162 is offline  
post #15 of 24 (permalink) Old 12-30-2009, 02:36 PM
Extremist
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: South of the Mason-Dixon
Posts: 4,895
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
           
So glad I don't need winter tires anymore Charlotte was RIGHT on the edge of that massive east coast snow storm recently and all we got was rain. I hate driving in the snow!

2010 Jaguar XFR - Mina exhaust with powdercoated tips, custom X-pipe, Mina carbon fiber front diffusers, hood louvers, mirrors and side vents, powdercoated stock Nevis wheels
The PL: It's all politics.
WRXtranceformed is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

  Lexus IS Forum > Off Topic > The Garage

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Lexus IS Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself. If your address is invalid, you will likely lose access to the site.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in











Current users viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
IMPORTANT Need Input on Winter Rims/Tires redliningit03 Wheels and Tires 3 01-18-2006 02:57 PM
Tire rotation: proper torque on wheel bolts important? kreativ Wheels and Tires 8 02-07-2002 04:43 AM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome